just a quicky RIP

remember when calculating you rake for a springer, the axle plates sit FORWARD of the imaginary line that leads from the headstock to the ground, so straight away you have a few degrees more (sort of the same effect as raked yokes - oops sorry, trees)depending on how long the axle plates are.

re-calculate carefully!

the main problem with raked trees (leading to what you referred to as the `death wobble´) is folks fitting them without thinking about how the REAR suspension affects the steering geometry. last year i had a virago 1100 in here with 7º yokes mounted, but with the standard length rear shocks. the negative trail was horrifying! it was the most unstable thing i´d ridden since an h1 kwak about 20 years ago. a bit of fiddling about and i finally got it working within the realms of safety, but the owner learned a valuable lesson!

With my numbers the 6 or 8 degrees in the neck with but me right on track as far as my trail sits.

I called my friend today, and I should be dropping off my bike on Tues to convert to a single down tube and add 8deg in the neck. It should be safe to run with my stock front end for a few months until I get my springer on. When it goes on the bike should ride even better than it does now.

Just another thought. Someone told me at work today, that unless I put a bigger tire on the back or a smaller tire on the front, my bike would slide through turns due to less traction. Again, this was coming from a guy I argued with for days about the Raider being a V Twin. He kept saying it was a V-4...

RIPBiker13 wrote:
Just another thought. Someone told me at work today, that unless I put a bigger tire on the back or a smaller tire on the front, my bike would slide through turns due to less traction. Again, this was coming from a guy I argued with for days about the Raider being a V Twin. He kept saying it was a V-4...


His advice sounds a little "iffy". Fact is , lots of folks advice when it comes to setting up a custom bike is iffy. BB

Well I'm not worried about what he said. I have a 180 18 in the rear and a 120 21 in the front. And besides, it's gonna look really cool! LOL

RIPBiker13 wrote:
Well I'm not worried about what he said. I have a 180 18 in the rear and a 120 21 in the front. And besides, it's gonna look really cool! LOL

your mate sounds like he´s heard something and misunderstood it. take with a LARGE pinch of salt!

IMO, your combination of a 120 front and 180 rear will give a cool appearence and good handling. going fat rear and skinny front (which some folks like, but to each their own) for my part seems to make the steering feel a bit rear dominant

be REAL careful with the steering geometry though.

standard rake is 32º, + raking the frame 8º takes it to 40º + +6º on the trees and you´re up to 46º, THEN take into account the offset of the axle plates on the springer and your heading to around 48º total theoretically, and looking at a headache to set up (just a question, did you factor in the fork length sufficient to bring the trail back into reasonable limits when you bought them, using the frame mods, etc, or did you buy them before you thought about frame mods?). then take into account 330kgs of weight

personally, i find more than 42º handles like a barge around town, but that´s just my opinion.

if you want to go radical and aint too fussed, fine, but do consider carefully what you want the bike to do (apart from looking cool ) before you start hacking the frame about. having to go back on steps in custom work is time consuming, expensive, and dissapointing.

either way, good luck mate!

The fat rear tires DOES make it rear dominant which is why I'm running the combo I have. I didn't go with a 250 because it feels heavy in the turns, and I didn't go with a 90/90/21 because it severely diminishes braking power.

The forks are longer than I need them. Much longer, so they will be cut to the proper length. And the trees I have are 0* so where did the 6* trees come in? I was only saying that 6* trees alone will throw off the trail and make it unstable at high speeds. So by those measurements I would be sitting at around 42deg. The real trick is setting the rockers. That's where I'm gonna make it or break it. But they can easily be adjusted by moving the 3rd triple tree up and down to get the right angle in relation to the ground.

My only real concern is ridability and ruining what is already a wonderful bike. But the Springer alone will change that. It won't make it worse only different. As long as the steering geometry stays within its proper boundaries, the only change will be the way it feels, and that I can get used to. It's not a sport bike and I can't really race it like you might a sport bike either. I'm not trying to take street corners at 50+mph and I'm not on a track. But I still need to be able to turn. The bike will never see a windshield or even bags for that matter.

But it IS a daily rider and I need it to stay that way. I ride in town quite often and can't afford not to be able to swerve when a car pulls out in front of me. Everything I've done to the bike over the past 3yrs has been methodically planned out and carefully executed. If I'm going to ruin my bike, please stop me now. But that springer is going on no matter what. My only real concern is the rake and with the springer that isn't a real issue. I've talked to a few people with this front end and they say the rear tire affected the ride more than the springer did.


This 2005 Roadstar was built by Don Gray, whom I speak to quite often, rides this bike almost everyday. It uses the same springer I have, and I am told this bike rides great. "A little much but handles great on the road and in town."

I want the set-up to look similar to this. Not extreme, just low and mean. hehe I rhymed! I'm going to find out what the rake of this V Star is. When I talked to Shane last I think he said it was 6deg.




It's got my springer on it and I love the stance! This was how I wanted my ride.

Probably right .... looks about 38 total.

The pic may be deceiving but it looks lower in front than back.

.... and no front fender .... I've had enough of those thank you. I don't know how you do it.

Doc

I called Shane at SS Custom Cycle this morning, he is the builder of the bike. He said he thinks it has 5deg trees. Then he told me my trees aren't 0deg like I thought. They are at least 3deg when I looked at them. So now I'm being told I'll NEED at least 6deg in the neck to compensate for the trees. This is becoming more of a headache than I thought. Long and low is what I want, and I have everything I need to get it, not I just need to figure out the right combination of the parts I have. I've set my bike up for this, 21in wheel, lowered 3in in the rear, etc.

As far as no front fender, it IS a pain but I can easily fab something up when I get the rest of my issues ironed out. I've been running without it for over a year. Another year wouldn't bother me too bad.